If you are on my Facebook, you’ll know that Sister 1 have “recently” given birth to a very healthy baby girl. Now, as per traditional Bruneian custom, all baby girls between the age of 40 to 60 days usually go through circumcision, so we had a little function thing for her. But I will talk about the function in another post. 🙂
Circumcision is always associated with mutilation of the vagina and has received a lot of bad publicity in the “Western world” because many think that it entails the total removal of the clitoris (or worse, sewing up of the vagina).
While that may be true in some countries, in Brunei obviously it is not. I went through circumcision, and I assure you that me, along with the bulk of Bruneian female population who have undergone the procedure/ritual, can very well testify that our clitoris(es) are safe and very well intact.
What circumcision really, is a rite of passage. What really is removed? According to the lady doing circumcising, who you will see in the video below, the removed bit is a very tiny bit of skin over the clitoris.
I am not sure however, if she was referring to the hood of the clitoris but I think not, because that would have been really painful, and result in a large bit of skin and profuse bleeding, which in this case did not happen. What happened was, there was only a miniscule amount of blood, and a microscopic bit of skin tissue. So I can’t really answer that question. I just don’t have enough expertise in the area. Any Bruneian gynaecologist care to comment?
Technical things aside, the video below is nothing short of a taboo. Usually, the only person allowed to see this kind of ritual would be the mother, grandmother and the lady conducting the procedure. Any other individual, including the child’s own father, are BANNED out of the room. After that no one really talks about the ceremony/ritual forever except for the occasional, “yes you were circumcised” when asked.
But in the name of education, here it is. Ypu might get a baby girl one day, who knows? So take comfort in the fact that the subject is now Google-able. 🙂
You will hear an annoying nasal voice narrating the video, and obviously that’s me, so my advise is to only watch it no more than 3 times. After 3 times, it gets rather annoying.
For maximum pleasure, please view the video first before reading continuation below.
For your information, Nini (holding the baby, the baby’s grandmother) closed her eyes throughout the whole debacle. She’s very discomforted around blood which makes her totally ineligible for an interview despite the fact that she has been present in now a total of 5 circumcisions.
The aged lady who conducted the procedure is a trained midwife and have done countless of circumcisions. There is a myth, that said that if there is no blood, the baby will grow up to be n old maid. 🙂 But that’s just a myth. (I hope) She also said that the best time for a baby to get circumcised is at exactly 44 days old. If it’s too early, there will be nothing to remove, but after 60 days, the skin will be too… “hard” (karas was the word) and it will be very painful for the baby.
After the whole thing was done, she instructed Nini to bury the dirt and cotton filled with the skin and blood under a flowering plant. Baby Z’s things was buried in earth rich with roots from a jasmine.
iammaurina 
Whoa! This is very…umm…WHOA! = O
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good whoa? bad whoa?
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They say it hurts a lot when a non-muslim converts, and they have to undergo circumcision. But I guess it’s because the skin “hardens” with age.
Eeps!
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Female Genital Mutilation and Male circumcision varies greatly in terms of why it is done and so on. While male circumcision is obligatory in most cases, female circumcision or female genital mutilation has no place in islam. There has not been any ayats in the quran or hadeeth that talks about female genital mutilation or circumcision. It is more like a cultural aspect rather than a religious one. It has been practiced in ancient Egypt and parts of Africa for thousands of years. It has been originally made to discriminate women to the extent that they get sewed up (female genital mutilation type3) to make women not to enjoy sexual intercourse. (well that’s not the case in Brunei). It is now still a major human rights issue that developing countries and governments have to combat in the 21st century.
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Another ignoramus who has not done his homework and believes all the nonsense Jewish & Western media is feeding him.
Faezul, please read this link I’m copying you to get the true picture:
http://www.anvermanatunga.net/english/female-circumcision-the-hidden-truth-by-asiff-hussein/
Read facts, not fiction!
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“…I assure you that me, along with the bulk of Bruneian female population who have undergone the procedure/ritual, can very well testify that our clitoris(es) are safe and very well intact.” – LOL!!
Mau, nicely done! While studying Form 6 Biology, I was told by my teacher that there is a controversy on whether males and females should get circumcised and that many Westerners think its unethical to do so. Obviously they think so because they have the wrong idea, especially in women – a misconception between circumcision and mutilation. Scientifically (and religion-wise, correct me if i’m wrong), it is to prevent any bacterial infection when foreskin is attached. This post and video sure helps. Good job, Mau.
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FYI, whilst it is WAJIB for a male to be circumcised, it is only SUNAT for females to be circumcised.
It is also now clear in the Western world that circumcision in men is beneficial as it helps to precent prostate cancer (in male circumcision, the foreskin is removed (the foreskin tends to harbour germs and whatnot if good hygeine is not practiced).
But when it comes to defending or explaining female circumcision, my knowledge is VERY limited, so yes I hope those in the know can help enlighten us as to any medical or scientific benefits. (PLS dont tell me it’s to kurangkan keghairan wanita cos I aint buying it!!! )
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female circumcision is done to prohibit female to enjoy sex before marriage. husband on wedding night removes stitches from the vagina for having sexual pleasure
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Infibulation or Pharaonic sewing of the vagina done in the Horn of Africa and exisions(total removal of the clitoris) done in most of Africa; are nothing compared to what is done in most of Muslim S.E.Asia.In the West,it is called clitoral unhooding and adult woman go for it to enhance sexuality,and it is the only form that can truly be called female circumcision as equivalent to male circumcision.
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Nicely done. The baby is now officially a child star. Hehe.
What came across my mind was, the job of a midwife itself. More often than not, midwives are middle-aged. I wonder if anyone from our generation is interested in pursuing the occupation. If there aren’t any, will female circumcision be done by doctors in the future? Perhaps, students pursuing a medical degree, especially that of gynaecology, should be trained for this task. But, the inclusion of this skill in gynaecology studies really depends on the consensus held by Islamic scholars, that is supported by the scholars in Brunei. In our case, this ritual is more of a form of Bruneian tradition, than part of our Islamic beliefs. At least I think so.
It is quite difficult to find medical journal articles about the circumcision we’re talking about – most are about genital mutilation. =\
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We based it upon one single hadith that said the Prophet (PBUH) only “encouraged” it when the girls are still little babies and said “do not remove exceeding the limit”. Google it up, ada tu. Seretu I read..
Yes,the Prophet (PHUH) told the woman circumciser in Messina ,not to cut to much ,but to make it beautiful,but for what I have read in the Koran there is no hadith staing the age it should be done for boys or girls? correct me if I am wrong?
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Anon: I would like to believe that Islamic practices based on Quran and sunnahs are meant to improve sexual relations in marriage, not inhibit sexual satisfaction. After all, a happy couple is the foundation of a happy family, and Islam is all about family.
One theory (I’m not sure if it’s verified) is that removing the foreskin in men, makes the penis less senstive, thus, prolonging erection, which is of course, good news for the ladies. But, another theory says leaving the foreskin on causes friction during sex which could stimulate the vagina, enhancing the experience, but at a cost of vulnerability to STDs and the length of the intercourse. I think I’ll take the prolonged erection, please. Some women take ages to achieve orgasm, and we all know how unhappy a woman can be if her male partner falls asleep before she reaches orgasm. :p
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Not a single second I blinked my eyes and mouth open throughout the whole video. With my current age, I can’t possibly imagine how painful will it be for me.
But burying in under a flowering plant, I don’t get it.
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I think this is an interesting topic to blog about, but I apologize for not reading it entirely. I’m a pretty visual person so when I saw the phrase “remove the clitoris” and “what is removed?” I freaked out. lol. Sorry ah 🙂
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Hey, darls! Sorry I haven’t been online in last couple of days… It’s good whoa la = D
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hmmmm…. inda brapa nampak dang eh.. tapi aku rasa ngiluuuu… Interesting! Hehehehe
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honestly mau, that doesn’t look like a very hygienic procedure. but, i guess it’s all adat and mine seems to be fine in present day. 🙂
i really do wish there was rubbing alcohol, or some form of antiseptic wipe rather than cotton wool and warm water… and i’m only hoping that an autoclave was used sometime beforehand!
but… then again, that’s just me and my incessant need for absolutely clean surgical procedures.
Interesting facts – but what concerns me more is – if the knife / blade they use is sterilised or is the midwife using a new blade to avoid deaseses like HIV for instance…just curious –
and emm this the first time i enter ur blog – cooL! : )
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the knife was provided by us and it’s new and sterilised 🙂
it’s like that with all circumcisions.
oh thanks! glad u like the blog!
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Aku nda brani baca… hahaha.. takutku.. quoting Andie “whoa”
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aku brani baca tapi takut takan play. i keep on takan play and pause play and pause and in the end aku tutup window.
Hi mau 😉
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Hahahah dont worry kamu.. Ok tu… Baca saja!
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Frankly speaking aku anie inda suka meliat yg gross gross ah … so I reserve my rights to click the “play” button. Pathetic you might call it despite the facts that I’ve already 3 daughters under my nose he.ehe.. good read and I’m sure other will benefit with this piece of informative post…
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There is nothing gross in the video. Seriously.. Might I remind you that the subjects in the video consist of my immediate family! So definitely nada gross, full frontal or whatever.
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Sunat Sunat… kalau boleh laki laki pun sunat dari damit. inda sakit.
🙂
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hahaha krg nada kan di potong. 😛 luan ALUS.
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Hi there. Well done on the informative piece about female circumcision. I was laughed at when i brought up this topic with my friends, many years ago. Obviously i did not have the opportunity as yours to witness a female circumcision (again) to find out. I compared the uncircumcised and circumcised female genitalia i.e. muslims and non muslims and yes, found out it is the hood of the clitoris that is removed.
During my ritual, i cried incessantly. I suspect it was because i was being held too tight. LOL.
Well done again!
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so ure telling me.. all bruneian women do not have hoods?
amusing hehehe
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okay I’ve read it, but aku nda mau liat the video.. the thought of it scares the living crap out of me..
nonetheless.. awesome post mau.. from a person who knew nothing about female circumcision.. now I know something.. I’ve always kinda been curious on what exactly yang kena potong.. heh
well done..
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Halus ya mu… esh esh….. Muaz atu sunat ber bious tidur kali eh…
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*NGILU!!!!!!* hahaha…bida muka saya membaca post ini wincing sini sana.
I dont remember exactly at what age I was circumsised but I know for sure I was already walking…entah kenapa akhir but I know my mum told me that inda batah lapas kena sunat atu I was up and about running here and there. hahahha…I have vague memory of this.
My sister yang terbungsu pun when she was walking dah so defnitely a few years old. She cried(I think) but mostly pasal the thought of kena potong.
I heard…wait, read somewhere(haha, selective bad memory) that bersunat, besides for health reasons, is a form of control, to kurangkan nafsu syahwat muslim women so inda terlampau gian, horny and sewaktu dengannya. Yang dipotong, just di ujung-ujung bits, yang the very and the most sensitive part but making sure inda over so that we can still enjoy love-making.
When you think about it, sudahpun muslim women can get turned on after bersunat…apatah lagi non-muslim women yg inda bersunat kan kan kan…with all the craziness out there i.e pronnns.
Genital mutilation going on in countries such as Africa, they cut more than necessary according to different customs hence the bad perception of the Islamic ritual.
Wallahu ahlam.
Wallahu ahlam.
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masa aku meliat video ku pigang tangan bikerboi takut ngiluuu berabis (dlm erti kata lain takut) huhu..
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this is… superbly interesting. *two thumbs up*
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Scientifically speaking, based on what my teacher had told me one time during bio lesson in my college years, we fems have these two labias, down there, or simply called as ‘skins’, labia minora and labia majora. And during circumcision, the labia minora is the one that is cut/removed although i dont know exactly what is done to it, but it is the labia minora, the ‘inner’ labia that is ‘removed’.
I got this info from a site;
“Labia Minora
The labia minora are the inner lips of the vulva, thin stretches of tissue within the labia majora that fold and protect the vagina, urethra, and clitoris. The appearance of labia minora can vary widely, from tiny lips that hide between the labia majora to large lips that protrude. The most common metaphor for the labia minora is that of a flower. Both the inner and outer labia are quite sensitive to touch and pressure.”
Quoting from the above statement, “The most common metaphor for the labia minora is that of a flower.” Hahah maybe that explains why its buried under a flowering plant? Clitoris and the two labias are definitely two different terms and areas. However, i am not so sure about this. Forgive me if i’m wrong. =p
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The removal of the labia minora(yes,looks like a flower maybe that is why these Muslim women bury it under a flowering plant) is called labiaplasty in the West.There is lots of information on it online,even before and after photos.You can google it up.The removal of the clitoral hood in the West is called clitoral unhooding(female circumcision).Some woman go for both as adults because of several reasons ranging from hygeine to sex to sagging with age and childbirth.Question aren’t baby girls virgens? if so the labia is not out,so how do you remove it?
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And yeah, again scientifically speaking hahah, its done to prevent any bacterial infections, like what lazy turtle has said.
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Hmm, according to that text, the labia minora is “a stretch of skin”. From the video, you can see the part that is removed is actually not a “stretch” but rather a thin blob. So that can’t be it. I still think it’s the hood.
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I don’t buy the ‘lessens sluttiness’ angle , because this is a girl who doesn’t even know how to be one of those yet. If they do this to decrease the rate of sin, then they should just strangle boys in the cradle before they become drug addicts, rapists or worse. Any survivors should be castrated like eunuchs- hey, look ZERO sin! Not all traditions are passed down on merit of intelligence alone, I say…
The only way to be a decent person is to will yourself that way, hood present or not. You may need support from family and friends , hood present or not. You may need advice from older people, hood or not.
I don’t think women have foreskin, but rather the tip of the hood (not the total hood)- totally ceremonial. As it’s not the same as foreskin on men (which is sewn in a way that it stops growing out) a woman probably will have it grown back in a way after a while.
It is illegal in Islam to remove someone’s body parts without necessity. Male circumcision is mandatory (but older faiths do it too and they’re still standing!) but female circumcision has to be done in such a way that you don’t remove a whole organ (the clitoris should be classified as one) and done properly- no jagged edges or profuse bleeding. If it turns out that female circumcision is nothing but pre-Islamic custom, it needs to be modified to follow the rules; a lot of Muslim countries however don’t do it and the law is vague- common sense must prevail here instead of hurried old men and women looking through pages of books written in their great grandfather’s time.
this link might clarify some things:
http://oum_abdulaziz.tripod.com/femalecircumcision.html
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Assalamualaikum Maurina.
I wanted to watch the video tapi nothing is there. Did you remove the video? I really want to see it. (mana tau beranak bini. huhu)
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W’salam Nuyui, the video is still there love. Can you tell me what exactly was on the screen?
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membari ngilu kan click and watch the video ih… hehehe. Actually circumcision for female hukumnya sunat or is it di haruskan ah (I need to check on the hukum lagi lah to confirm) and inda di mestikan. But for some people di brunei circumcision ani macam jadi tradition. For male yes di “wajibkan”
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Barutah ada. Yesterday it was totally grey and blank.
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ok, i really wanted to see a female circumcision because i was curious and i liked the way you presented it, but i still think it is useless. i heard that in some parts of the world, people do that so that the girls would not feel this kind of pleasure until married. but if you say that the clitoris is intact (which i sort of doubt) it means that you still feel pleasure and that it is actually useless. well, i understand it is your religion but i do not agree with this kind of worshiping.
thanks for the visual presentation though 🙂
Andreea, Romania (Europe).
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i prefer.. “devotion” to worshipping. 🙂 im glad you liked the video;
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Dear Maurina,
Interesting but rarely discussed topic you have out it here… Anyway, I did a 10,000 words paper on Cultural Practices vs. religion, focusing on Female Genital Mutilation (FGM) for my Human rights course as part of my degree 6 yrs back…
Ada tujuannya bersunat bagi perempuan, mengikut satu hadis nabi, if i remember correctly, the circumcision practice for girls in Islam is not as barbaric/cruel as many Westerners have thought..it is done only to the extent to menaikkan seri muka and not to cause any injury, hence the miniscule blood during the practice… it has been years since i did the paper… payah ku kan ingat.. remembering back ..after my daughter bersunat i did see a subtle and nice change in her looks… my sister had the same experience after her daughter was circumcised, makin berseri mukanya.
Some people in the other parts of the world tend to sterotype female circumcision with female genital mutilation. this is because in some countries such as Somalia and Sudan, those who practice FGM claimed that they do it in the name of religion, i.e. suruhan agama… they even say Allahu Akbar when they did it…
How do they do it? They sew the whole thing up until they say the female private parts are as smooth as the palm of your hand… they only leave a hole as big as a matchstick head for urination and menstruation.. they did not use any anaesthetic and as a result some girls actually died from the process… they used dirty and blood-stained knives, where some girls died of infection… usually the mother would force their girls to go through it… one woman will hold the legs open while the mother will hold the upper body so that the girls wont struggle or move a lot…
how do they sew it after that? usually the girls would pengsan by this stage due to loss of blood.. the midwives would just use some thorn or yg moden pakai jarum and some string..
After that the girls are left alone in a hut with their legs bound together so that the sewn part would heal and the skin are formed together.. imagine the pain when they urinate…
After it has healed, the girl would take nearly 30mins to urinate due to the tiny hole left..menstruation is painful as well..i remember reading a case where a bloated girl went to see the doctor (the locals actually thought she was pregnant!) and after going through an operation to open up the sewn part… litres of foul smelling blood gushed out.
When the girls get married, their husband would ‘pry the hole open’ with a knife on their wedding night.. and the morning after, they would go around the village proudly with the blood-stained dagger on their shoulder proving that thay have married a virgin, pure girl…
SUch practice is still carried out even after they migrated to Europe. In UK, an immigrant turned up the music to full blast to drown out the screams of his daughter while the process was conducted.
Some FGM-ed girls would go through operations to open up their private parts…so once they have done it, they feel liberated when for the first time it will only take them a minute to urinate instead of the agonising 30mins. Menstriation would not be as painful as before
You may want to google for ‘Waris Dirie’. She is a Somalian girl who has gone through FGM herself and has made it big by becoming a supermodel. She is a UN Goodwill Ambassador fighting for this cause.
It is this practice yang membuat kan some people to regard female circumcision in Islam is a barbaric practice when it is entirely different.
I am glad to share this… We must be grateful to be born in Brunei and not share the same fate as some girls in Africa
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kesian ah those girls. i cant imagine living a life like theirs. so much chance of infection. eeek. thanks for the insight learned reader. very much appreciate it.
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I don’t know if someone has mentioned it already (i tried to read all of the comments but it was way too long for me:)) but I think in Brunei, the act of be-sunat is more of a symbolic prick of a very very tiny area of the clitoral hood. It’s also a cultural practice rather than a religious one since i think it is not sunat in our mazhab. i came across a few interesting reasons for female circumcision but these are the only ones that I can remember:
– for some culture, it’s a beauty statement (to the eyes of the husband i guess)
– increases the female satisfaction during intercourse (applies if the clitoral hood is removed so increase surface area for stimulation, i think…in the US, removal of clitoral hood is offered as plastic/cosmetic surgery for this very reason!!!)
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I’m a 29 year old chinese girl. My fiancee is Malay. I will soon become a mualaf
Is bersunat required for female mualaf ??? My fiancee told me that he much prefer I do circumcision…( ouch )..before wedding
Honestly I’m a bit scared ;( for the obvious reason.
Any female mualaf out there who had been thru this experience ?? Would you mind sharing your experience?? Don’t have to reveal your real name of course
Does it hurt ?? How long did it take to heal ??
Does it affect ur sex life ??
wassalam,
jenny
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Jenny, first of all, there are a lot of opinions about this issue of circumcision wen onverting to Islam, and since i’m far from being an expert therefore the best way to get answers is by calling up the Pusat Dakwah hotline. Not sure of the number but I am definitely sure it is available by calling 113. I wish you luck and hope you will share your answers with those here. 🙂
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But from where I stand, off the record, I am hoping that your future husband will not force you to do something that you do not want to do especially something as traumatising as circumcision. Conversion to Islam is a matter of the heart, not the clitoris, after all. 🙂
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my mother is a mualaf and no, its actually not necessary jua. 🙂 Mum says you do it by will and if ur not willing to do it then don’t do it.
Great one maurina tapi i takut to see the video because once my baby sister bersunat i was outside and she didnt cry at all. Brave baby!
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refering to Learned Redear’s, there is a book called Desert Flower by Waris Dirie. i think she did mention about her & other girls’ experience going through female circumcision 🙂 Chapter 4, Becoming a Woman
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A friend of mine is a doctor in Pusrawi (Pusat Rawatan Islam) here in Penang.
She told me that bersunat for female mualaf is suprisingly quite common. She regularly circumcise young women who converts to Islam, most cases for marriage.
She also said it’s quick and not as bad as most people would imagine. Usually heals completely in 10-14 days
One thing for sure, it’s done secretly and quietly to avoid embarassment. Usually the patient will ask that the procedure done at home, then she can stay home until she completely heals.
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For Miss Jenny Chan first of all I’d like to say Alhamdullilah we have a new sister.
If you happen to be in Malaysia you can talk to female doctors at Pusrawi. They will explain the procedure, maybe even introduce you to some of their former patients who had gone thru the experience of bersunat as adult.
When your heart is strong and willing, the you can go ahead and do ‘bersunat’ Insya Allah it won’t hurt that much
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Great work Maurina. This puts islamic-style FC into context and hopefully those who don’t understand will begin to …
On female mualaf, I marrried a non-muslim and have some experience to share.
My wife underwent berkhatan at pusrawi in KL. She was 29 y.o. then. It took about 5 minutes for the procedure, from the time she went into the surgery to the time she left. With the special ubat given, the cut healed in about 1 day.
As for what was cut, i say about 1/3 to 1/2 of the hood was removed … btw, my wife is happy that she had it done. She will have any daughters circumcised. No regrets 🙂
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Imagine that American women are paying thousands of US dollars to have the same procedure called ‘hoodectomy’ or ‘clitoral hood removal’
In Malaysia and Brunei it costs nothing 🙂
It’s a proof that female circumcision done correctly according to Sunnah is beneficial 🙂
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Learned Friend (blogger 39) needs to understand that Waris Dirie doesn’t represent the Somali community or its culture. She is an outcast and a marauding she-goat who is using the Somali culture to gain pelf and position. Much as I appreciate that the Somali people (I’m one of them, though I’m he) practiced infibulation in the past and that Waris may have suffered, Waris and her accomplices like the legendary atheist, Ayaan Hiris Magan have built their empires of deceit on the fact that they were subjected to FGM by tradition but they had to assign it to Islam for marketability. They knew Islam was on the receiving end so blaming it will raise the stakes of those who are involved. Their case is the proverbial fox whose children were killed by a camel but accused goats of killing them. The fox knew she couldn’t kill a camel but a goat was a walkover. Ayaan and her accomplices knew the only way of gaining pelf and position was blaming Islam.
That said, Desert Girl as a book is the concoctions of a pornster called Waris Dirie and not an honest detail of a barren tradition that’s affecting a Muslim community. The book is pure stereotype purposely concocted to scare the Western reader and make a brisk sale.
Coming down to the Somalis, I must say we have come along way and we are almost to discard the tradition. In fact, infibulation/mutilation has stopped in its entirety. The next step is stopping it entirely as al-Imam, Dr. Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi and the Islamic Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (IESCO) have preached and advised.
http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503548446
Despite the fact that many Somalis have totally abandoned the circumcision of girls, there are quite a number of people who still prefer to do albeit in a simple way. They call it Sunna Circumcision and the old (painful and pathetic) one was Called Pharaonic Circumcision. So I guess it will be terribly important to inform them of the Brunei/Malay female circumcision and how it is done as seen in the clip. May be it will be useful but as person, I take Dr. Qaradawi’s position that it must end (totally), but will not castigate any Muslim for doing a simple one as depicted in the clip. Remember, the Somalis are 100% Muslims and all of them follow the Shaf’I Madhhab which calls for female circumcision. But many Somalis today discourage it saying that it has no effective Islamic basis. But if people may practice the simple Brunei one, I believe it has no problem. Do the Malays also circumcise all their girls like the Bruneians? Pliz shed light on this.
Fainally, blogger no. 50, Izzah mentioned something called “hoodectomy” practiced by Western women today, actually the West today is practicing FGM as much as they lambaste Islam and Muslims for doing so. I have blogged about it. Pliz read the article in the Medical News Today (provided) and you will see that they practice FGM albeit disguised. http://aalarashid.blogspot.com/2007/05/europe-in-stampede-for-modern-fgm.html
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This form is widely practiced among many S.E. Muslims including Brunei,Malaysia,Indonesia,Muslims of Thailand,Singapore and Mindanoa(Phillipines)
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My late mother is a doctor who worked closely with Pusat Bimbingan Mualaf
Part of her job is explaining ‘bersunat for women’ to female mualaf. She also explained that it’s sunat and not wajib. If they decided to do it, then it’s her job to circumcise them.
It’s obvious that, regarding circumcision, the first thing that comes to mind is the pain. One thing she always told the female mualaf is “Imagine giving birth. If you can endure that, then bersunat is really nothing”
Alhamdulilah, many of them decided to get circumcised.
She told me that once she had a 30-year old Chinese lady who had a child from previous marriage. She became a mualaf to marry a Malay man. She was a bit too scared for circumcision. Then my mother told her ” You had been giving birth before. The pain from bersunat is nothing compared to it ” She finally agreed to bersunat 🙂
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To Mr. Azlan :
Everything that you wrote seems to make sense, except one thing.
You said that the cut healed in 1 day. As a doctor I would say it’s impossible. What kind of medicine was used ???
For that kind of cut where the clitoral hood is removed, I would say it takes at least a week before the cut is healed, probably even longer.
My wife once accidentally cut herself down there while shaving and it took a week to heal
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Maybe she’s on a high protein diet hehe
…and spent the day resting.
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I would say that the story is probably a hoax, and the creator did’t do a good research on how long a cut should heal…
Sorry man 😉
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As a qualified medical personnel I would say that no matter how healthy she is, and no matter what medication is employed, that kind of cut is simply impossible to heal in one day.
If there is such medicine, it surely has much better use than healing circumcision cuts, it would save a lot of lives.
To my knowledge so far, there is no medicine with such supreme healing power.
I agree with Dr. Johari. It’s probably a hoax.
Perhaps Mr.Azlan Z has something to say ???
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Although I do agree it is somewhat impossible that the cut would heal in one day, and even more so with two doctors commenting! 🙂 But maybe his wife meant it didnt hurt anymore after one day. It might not have completely healed but the pain might have went away? Or at least become bearable.
Just a possibility. Different people have different threshold for pain. 🙂
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My wife is a muallaf. She converted 5 years ago before marriage.
A few weeks before our wedding, I took her to a local pusrawi for bersunat. She was 25 year old then.
After marriage she told me that before sunat, her clitoris was often itchy because the clitoral hood was too long and hard to clean.
After sunat, the itch was gone with the clitoral hood. Now she feels much cleaner and happy with the result 🙂
And our sex life is never a problem
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well it cleans the smegma the same itchy,smelly substance that accumulates under the male’s foreskin
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sorry doctors and “qualified medical personnel” … it took a day to heal.
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To Mr. Azlan Z :
Then perhaps you can explain what medicine was used.
If it is as good as you said, it would save a lot of lives.
Or maybe you can check your wife again. If it really healed in a day, maybe it was just a symbolic nick, nothing was removed.
Or maybe your wife has superhuman healing power, which in this case we can study her and again, save a lot of lives 🙂 lol
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hello Dr X
Here is a suggestion … contact Pusrawi, find out about what they do, medicine used, etc.
then come to a medical conclusion.
case study? you sound more like a sex pervert than a medical practitioner with a name like Dr X 🙂 lol
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A question to Jenny, Dec 05:
Has it been done by now and without any force?
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Maurina – Thanks for opening my eyes even wider to the barbarity of Islam.
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Hey!
This female circumcision’s got nothing to do with religion! Cant believe ppl have such wrong ideas about Islam, sheesh
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It’s too bad then, that this mutilation is being done in the name of Islam by people who are Muslims.
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The Hadith that Abdullah here has quoted is a ‘Zaeef’ hadith, which means it comes from broken linkages and has no standing if it isnt further backed up.
Its unfortunate that people have been using our religion to do things that the religion originally forbids. But you cannot judge a religion by its followers, read the Quran once along with its explanation and see if you can find anything objectionable or inhumane in it…
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In the west female circumcision is done when women have a clitoris that is too large for them to live comfortably, it isnt something that a normal female is to be put through.
People should do their research on beliefs that seem all wrong, rather than just accept them because they were told it is the right way. Its this subservient ignorance that has driven us so far from the path our creator laid down for us.
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Among many attributes, I do judge a religion by its followers. It wouldn’t make sense not to.
The Zaeef – does that mean something like ‘weak?’ That’s a new one for me.
Rare is the case when a clitoris is too large to sit comfortably, and in those rare cases, the Western answer is not surgery anymore. Doctors wised-up in the early 1980s thank goodness.
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Yes, the literal meaning of ‘Zaeef’ is weak.
And i didnt even know there was such a thing as female circumcision until i read this post, so forgive me for my lack of knowledge!
But ive looked into this, and this is a culture thing rather than a religion thing. Unfortunately people know all too well to twist the words of God to justify their wrong-doing.
The women in Madina and Macca in the Prophet’s(P.B.U.H) time were never circumcised, the Quran never stated such a thing, so please stop blaming religion for the ill-acts of a bunch of ignorant people…
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I do not believe that this is the first time you’ve heard of it, but I am accustomed to people dismissing the connection of the practice with Islam.
Here’s what I know to be true.
Many Muslims promote the sunna version of genital mutilation, as substantiated by Maurina’s revolting video.
Those who torture Muslim girls in this way cite the Sunan Abu Dawud Hadith which claims that Mohammed approved of the practice.
At the local level, those who commit female genital mutilation believe it to be religiously mandated – whatever that religion may be.
Many girls in different religious cultures are mutilated, but mutilation of girls in Islamic societies is epidemic. Most of today’s 130 million mutilation victims – the ones who lived through it – are Muslim.
It does not matter if women in Madina and Macca in the Prophet’s time were circumcised or not. The only truth that matters is that it is happening in our times, and that it is a crime against humanity.
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“I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.” (Hitler)
Im sure Jesus did not want Hitler and his men to murder Jews, however, that is what Hitler seemingly believed. Do you understand the fact that it takes merely one twisted mind to misinterpret and misquote in God’s name and that millions of mindless others will follow like blind mice?!
Yes, the truth of the time is that this is happening in our present, but religion is not to blame for it, it is not a sunnah, and the hadith is weak hence as good as non-existent.
there are about 1.4 billion muslims in the world today. If 130 million of them believe in female circumcision, there’s still about 1.3 billion muslims who do not believe in it!
But of course, you conveniently ignore these statistics to come to a conclusion you have already previously made. Your skills of judgement, my friend, do not seem very different from the ignorant lot we speak of here.
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but yes, this whole thing is very appalling and its really beyond me how people can be so ignorant as to believe in this injustice…
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Don’t forget this is also happening to boys and men in some countries and the people fighting circumcision are called intactivists.
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inTACTivists! Awesome!
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Don’t forget this is also happening to boys and men in some countries and the people fighting circumcision are called intactivists.
Actually male circumcision is much crueler than removing the clitoral hood,think about the size and the amount of skin removed.
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Actually the Koran does not mandate either circumcision of males and females
Female circumcision as far as removal of clitoral hood and labia minora is optional and is the only one allow .
Male circumision is prefered,but not obligatory or mandatory,no where in the Koran does it say male circumcision is a mandate.
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Thank you,R,for the information on The Koran most people don’t know that circumcision is optional.Same with the Jewish faith God did not mandate circumcision. In the original version of the Torah, the book of J, circumcision is not even mentioned. Fallible men devised circumcision as a way to curb masturbation. Even Rabbi Maimonides acknowledged this fact.But for whatever reason it is done circumcision of children should not be allowed and makes me sad especially when someone is maimed or killed which happens all the time.
Tuesday, August 05, 2008
Child dies in circumcision
http://www.sunstar.com.ph/static/dum/2008/08/05/news/child.dies.in.circumcision.html
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Dear all
Pardon me for coming into a discussion that deals with intimate women’s issues, but i found it very interesting, particularly since my wife intends to undergo the procedure shortly. She yearns to have a circumcised clit without the ugly and smelly prepuce which gets in her way, particularly during oral sex.
Besides this procedure commonly known as hoodectomy in the west is a religious requirement for Muslim females as is apparent in an interesting article which could be accessed in http://www.hoodectomy.com
Ahmed
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The website you mention has moved. It may now be found at http://www.hoodectomyinformation.com. Hope this helps!
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Oops sorry, the website’s http://www.geocities.com/hoodectomy/Islam.htm
Ahmed
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Perhaps the medical community should start introducing the benfit of clitoral hoodectomy for women, just as circumcision benefits for men.
Then the religious side would not be so ‘cornered’ and discredited.
If it’s truly beneficial, then women of other faiths will start doing it, just like male circumsision is widely practicedby people of all faiths
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The e-mail on hoodectomy which I gave earlier has been shifted to http://www.hoodectomyinformation.com/
Ahmed
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Assalamu alaikum,
very interesting and controversial topic.
I am a western female who converted to islam in NAD, indonesia, in 2005, so i also had female circumcision in my mid twenties. It was not what i expected because i had only heard of the “cut/rip it all out and sew it all up” type like what goes on in sub-saharan africa. My experience was that i went to the local midwife with two support ladies , i removed my underwear spread the legs and she had a look around my bits, wiped something on my clitoris (maybe general anesthetic?) then asked me if i remembered how to say the shahada “ash hadu an laa ilaa ha ill-Allah” (“i bear witness that there is no god besides Allah”) and then the moment i said it there was a very swift and fast cut to the top four milimetres (well i have never actually measured myself, but there abouts.)
it was painful like a massive clitoris based orgasm or very hot, for point two five of a second. And then nothing. The midwife put some kind of medicine on it. And i could put my underwear on. Because it was so clinical , i would rate the pain as like getting your ears pierced with the spring gun. Sore for a moment.
Healing wise i didn’t have any pain or bleeding at all, even when i went home and urinated i thought it would sting but nothing. It took two weeks for me to feel normal as i really did miss that part of me.
Sex after this procedure, um well it made a difference to me in that the orgasm is more felt at g spot or whole body and can achieve more multiples, but i think the sensitivity of the clit area is kind of all or nothing really. Maybe each woman is different. A good thing that came out of it was that i used to get cystitis at least three times a year even to the point of kidney infection, but since i had been circumcised i only had it once in four years.
The reasons that the people gave to me in NAD about this adat was “because it is more Sah”. I did think my face brightened a little, mostly the eyes area. Thanks.
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assalam mualaikum Julina,
Just curious. Did the midwife cut the clitoris itself or removing the hood or skin covering it ? If you said about 4 mm was cut then I assume it’s the hood. If 4 mm was cut from your clit then it’s probably going to cause some rather heavy bleeding.
So do u still have your clit ?? How sensitive if was compared to before sunat ?
Pls answer as I’m planned to get bersunat myself. My fiancee asked me to to it before the wedding. He took a close look ata my genital and said that I have not been circumcised.
Thanks
Jasmine
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Your husband wants YOU to get circumsized more likely because he believes it will give him more sexual pleasure than anything else such as being religious, etc.
How do I know?
How can he be a devout Muslim (thus justifying insisting you go through circumcision because of belief) and be able to access what is only legally/religiously accessible AFTER marriage (seeing you naked to the point of even examining your clitoris and knowing you are not circumsised!)?
I would advise you to think about the intention before going through it.
Islam and God looks at the intention of the Muslim when it comes to doing anything.
If the intention is wrong it still is a sin and I believe disapproved/disregarded by God.
Chat with him, do your research and examine your faith and understanding of Islam and the beauty of the concept of intent and ask yourself – is this what I want for love of God or for love of man (and that too has the wrong intention for wanting you to go through it.)
Why go through the pain and motion/ritual without the sincere intent needed? It will be a waste.
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alsalaam alaikum ,
i’m just curious about one thing i had it properly done when i was very young and now my sister just came back from the clinic and shes running all over the place so i guess its like ear piercing just painful for a second , so my question is does it reduce sexual pleasure because i read somewhere that it does i’m not married yet so i have no idea (my question is for people who are for it not against it)
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oh and is it the plastic surgery removal of clitoral hood or different ,if it is how so ?
Thanks in advance ! 🙂
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Dear Sister
Your concerns are understandable. This depends on the type of circumcision. It is only the Islamically approved Sunna form (which involves the removal of the skin or prepuce covering the clitoris)that does not affect female sexual pleasure. The other types such as removing the clitoris or even the tip of it (the glans clitoris) can certainly affect your sex life negatively and therefore have to be avoided. This is because the tip of the clitoris which is full of pleasure stimuli is vital for a proper sex life.
The proper Islamic procedure which involves the removal only of the piece of dirty skin covering the clitoris can on the other hand lead to an improved sex life. This is because it does away with the greatest obstacle to clitoral stimulation, which is the skin covering it, thereby exposing the surface area of the clitoris and particularly its glans (glans clitoris) to greater stimulation, whether it be penile, oral or tactile.
You must also understand that the proper Sunna procedure is extremely beneficial health-wise as it does away with the dirty piece of skin around the clitoris which is responsible for the accumulation of a filthy substance known as smegma which allows germs to breed freely thus making the uncircumcised woman more susceptible to infections not only in this vital area, but also in the urinary tract leading to complications such as cystitis. This is because germs thriving under the skin of the clitoris could easily find their way up the urinary tract.
Besides, an uncircumcised clitoris is very smelly and gives out a foul odour which is particularly noticed by a partner who wishes to indulge in oral sex, thereby turning him off. Studies have shown that men are turned off by unpleasant smells during sex and if you wish that your husband should enjoy sex with you, it is best to have that area clean, in other words circumcised.
You would be surprised to learn that even western women are now freely choosing to undergo the procedure which is known there as hoodectomy. For research studies and personal testimonies from women who have benefited from the procedure please see http://www.hoodectomyinformation.com. Only now is the west coming to know of its benefits. And to think, Islam prescribed it over 1400 years ago.
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Thank you so much!
i was very concerned because when i looked up female circumcision ,the results that came up were the type of circumcision done in some parts of Africa which was definitely scary ,so thanks for clearing things up:)
and i agree with you Islam did prescribe a lot of things that were beneficial health wise its just some people’s prejudice that keeps them from listening to what Muslim people believe in.
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An uncircumcised one is not smelly. You are very ignorant.
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Also no trace of smegma even if I don’t wash for a few days!! You are even more ignorant than I thought.
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but the hood is not the ony part producing smegma,also some women have large labia minora(the inner lips) that produce smegma and foul odor and urinaty trac infections hence most women go for the labiaplasty with clitoral hood reduction,
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In reply to sister jasmin who intends to get married. I’m sure it was the very tip of my clitoris because in Aceh language they use that word clitoris “itil”. The skin over it WAS NOT CHANGED AT ALL.
I later read that muslim woman are only allowed to have removed “as much of it as can be kissed.. and not allowed to remove so much that it will cause the woman to lose intimate pleasure” but you’ll have to do some research because i can’t give you a reference. Maybe an ustaz can give us the details please.
For me, pleasure was changed in area not so much in amount so like I said the g-spot and all body pleasure went up and clitoris sensitivity went down so had more multipules. I’m not sure if all of malay muslims make a point of difference between cutting the tip of the skin over the clitoris or the actual tip of the clitoris, but if one is “sah” (islamically valid) and the other is not, then there is alot of work to be done in bringing about awareness about such matters. I hope the best for you sister. Have a great feast!
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Sorry to hear that sister Julina. I hope it has not adversely affected your sex life. Fortunately only a bit of the glans of the clitoris seems to have been taken off when you were done, so it has probably not affected you adversely. However strictly speaking, you have not been circumcised properly as the skin covering your clitoris is still intact and it is advisable to get it removed by a qualified practitioner.
And thanks for sharing your experience. It only shows how ignorant some female circumcisers are of the real procedure which consists of removing the skin covering the clitoris and not any part of the clitoris itself. This means that sister Jasmine will have to be careful when she gets it done. The best thing is to get it done by a qualified female physician rather than a traditional midwife.
Here again I repeat, what is required in Islam, is the removal of only the prepuce of the clitoris, and not the clitoris itself. The Prophet is reported to have told Umm Atiyyah, a lady who circumcised girls in Medina: “When you circumcise, cut plainly and do not cut severely, for it is beauty for the face and desirable for the husband” (idha khafadti fa ashimmi wa la tanhaki fa innahu ashraq li’l wajh wa ahza ind al zawj) (Abu Dawud, Al Awsat of Tabarani and Tarikh
Baghdad of Al Baghdadi).
This hadith clearly explains the procedure to be followed in the circumcision of girls. The words: “Cut plainly and do not cut severely” (ashimmi wa la tanhaki) is to be understood in the sense of removing the skin covering the clitoris, and not the clitoris. The expression “It is beauty (more properly brightness or radiance) for the face” (ashraq li’l wajh) is further proof of this as it simply means the joyous countenance of a woman, arising out of her being sexually satisfied by her husband. The idea here is that it is only with the removal of the clitoral prepuce that real sexual satisfaction could be realized. The procedure enhances sexual
feeling in women during the sex act since a circumcised clitoris is much more likely to be stimulated as a result of direct oral, penile or tactile contact than the uncircumcised organ whose prepuce serves as an obstacle to direct stimulation.
A number of religious works by the classical scholars such as Fath Al Bari by Ibn Hajar Asqalani and Sharhul Muhadhdhab of Imam Nawawi have stressed on the necessity of removing only the prepuce of the
clitoris and not any part of the organ itself. It is recorded in the Majmu Al Fatawa that when Ibn Taymiyyah was asked whether the woman is
circumcised, he replied: “Yes we circumcise. Her circumcision is to cut the uppermost skin (jilda) like the cock’s comb.” More recently Sheikh Jadul Haqq declared that the circumcision of females consists of the removal of the clitoral prepuce (Khitan Al Banat in Fatawa Al Islamiyya.
1983).
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yes,think of the clitoris like a small penis and the true circumcision of the clitoris is just like the male version to remove the prepuce or skin of the clitoris just like the forekin of a male .The word circumciison in Latin menas to cut in a circle
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Not meaning to derail this thread, but I am curious what is the position of Islam on male foreskin restoration? That is, a circumcised male who chooses to have his foreskin restored either surgically or also non-surgically? (Either surgically with a skin graft or through stretching the skin of the shaft over a period of time until it covers the glans.)
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A great post, especially with Ahmad’s comments; but the video was removed, could it be re-uploaded? thanks.
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Hi Atiyyah, I’d love to reupload it but YouTube regard it as a violating the terms of use on grounds that it is a culturally sensitive topic and also because a lot of YouTube watchers are stupid boors who do not appreciate any other culture but their own. Grr! I apologise!
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If you speak Indonesian / Malay, there is an intersting discussion on female circumcision in this Muslim website:
http://kaferemaja.wordpress.com/2009/07/01/cantiknya-muslimah-bila-dikhitan-subhanallah/
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I don’t speak or read these languages, but am glad for any information I receive. I wonder if the situation you describe here actually is a form of hood reduction or removal, and the small amount of blood is only because there is so little to remove in such a small, young girl…?
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You can try to use the Google translation. It’s far from perfect but it will get you some idea.
The discussion I was reffering above talks about female circ for adult women where the clitoral hood is removed.
Of course, the skin removed is just 2-3 mm in size.
The result is better hygine and better sexual satisfaction coz the glans is exposed.
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That is correct. At http://www.hoodectomyinformation.com links and reports of several medical studies are provided that report 97% satisfaction rates from women who have had this done. Those kinds of positive reports are virtually unheard of for any other medical procedures! Just as Maya says, hygiene gets much easier and sexual satisfaction is greatly improved.
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Dear Sisters
Does anyone know of some hospitals in the South East Asian countries of Malaysia, Indonesia or Brunei that undertake Islamic female circumcision (hoodectomy) for adult women in a hygienic hospital environment. What is the cost and healing time ?
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Brother Ahmed, in Malaysia you can do it as Pusrawi (Pusat Rawatan Islam or Islamic Medical Center), maybe best in KL. In fact, it’s quite common for adult women to get circumcised, esp mualaf. Cost is very cheap, less than USD 50.
Right after circumcision, she can do most daily activities. Complete healing should take less than two weeks.
Sex should be OK after 2 weeks, and of course, with the exposed clitoral glans, she would enjoy new wonderful sensations.
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Thanks Sister Betina, May Allah bless you !
Really do appreciate it. Its a very useful service they are providing and for a very reasonable fee. The fact that the women undergoing the operation heal so fast speaks well of the doctors performing the procedure. It is not easy to find a hospital in Asia doing it the proper Islamic way and in a modern hospital setting though many do exist in the west offering what is known as hoodectomy which is basically the same thing.
Would appreciate if you or other viewers could provide details of other hospitals in South East Asia and particularly Malaysia offering the procedure for adult women performed by women doctors. My wife and I who promote the procedure as a religious obligation at a time when this practice is being maligned by certain ill-informed sections of the Western Media often get requests from our Asian friends (including Muslim women who have not had it properly performed in their childhood, it being a common practice in many communities to extract a mere drop of blood instead of trimming the prepuce) where to perform the procedure and dare not tell them to go all the way to the West for the purpose other than to recommend a traditional practitioner, which many however do not look at positively as it is not in a hospital setting. And besides they are afraid that she’ll remove more than just the clitoral prepuce. Having it done in a hospital on the other hand is safe and clean and one can rest assured knowing very well what’s going to be cut, and that’s what’s important.
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Dear Brother Ahmed,
May Allah bless you and your wife. You mention that you and your wife are trying to promote the procedure ? May I ask how you do that? Perhaps thru educations, both to the public and to the medical communities.
If you seriously try to promote the procedure, I think Muslim women in Indonesia need you badly. The Indonesian Ministry of Health banned the so called ‘female circumcision’ procedure a few years ago, and of course, the ban was met with strong resistance from Indonesian Islamic Council and other Islamic groups, and even until now there is no clear solution. It’s still an ongoing debate while many, maybe most Muslims girls and women are either uncircumcised or not properly circumcised.
I think the Indonesians should look up to their sisters in Malaysia.
May Allah have the answers.
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yes,many Indonesians and other prick or pierce with a large needel and these women swear they are circumcised,which they are not.
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Clitoral hoodectomy offers many benefits to women and their husbands / partners. With the exposed glans clitoris, women enjoy better hygine and better sexual pleasure.
However, for some women, the benefit might be a little too much. The exposed glans is constantly rubbing agains clothing, etc and the woman will get sexually excited too easily. Thus easily leading to improper behavior such as excessive masturbation, or even extramarital sex.
Hence, in addition to clitoral hoodectomy, it is also recommended to cut very lightly the very top of the glans clitoris. The cut should not exceed 1 mm off the tip.
This way, the sensitivity of the glans clitoris shall be slightly reduced, but not to the point of diminishing her sexual desires and pleasures. She would be more than sensitive enough to have orgasm, but not constantly aroused.
This way, the best result and benefit is achieved, from medical, hygine, and Islamic point of view.
Wassalam
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The clitoris harders, doesn’t become more sensitive over the passage of time. You have got it wrong. Sorry!
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The clitoris harders, doesn’t become more sensitive over the passage of time. You have got it wrong. Sorry!
So does the penis’s glans after male circumcision.No wonder America is the land of K-Y Jelly!
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Hence, in addition to clitoral hoodectomy, it is also recommended to cut very lightly the very top of the glans clitoris. The cut should not exceed 1 mm off the tip.
No where in the Koran does it say to cut any part of the glans of the clitoris.
Ouch! To cut 1 mm off the tip of the clitoris ,imagen cutting one 1mm of the tip of the glans of the penis? Ouch! The glans should be left intact and truly intact would be left alone with its skin on it.
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Thanks for your observations, sister Betina. They are indeed timely. I must however confess that I too was once an opponent of female circumcision believing as I did then the adverse publicity in certain sections of the western media that it was meant to keep women in subjugation and to control their sexual desires by depriving them of the much needed clitoris. I also tended to believe some so-called Islamic scholars who spoke out against the practice and even declared it unislamic.
A friend however cautioned me and advised me that I do a little research on the topic instead of jumping into conclusions. What I found surprised me. There was indeed a strong basis for the practice in Islam with some of the world’s greatest Islamic scholars including Ibn Taymiyyah and Sheikh Jadd-ul-Haqq holding the practice to be mandatory in Islam. Surely what was in Islam cannot be wrong. I was also in for a pleasant surprise when I learned that what was needed to be done was to remove the prepuce covering the clitoris (just like the foreskin taken off in the circumcision of males) and not the clitoris itself and that the procedure rather than reducing actually increased sexual feeling in women during the sex act. Later on I was thrilled to learn from a well known site promoting the procedure that western women were themselves increasingly choosing to undergo this procedure which is known as hoodectomy for greater genital hygiene and a better sex life. My wife though a born Muslim had not been circumcised properly and agreed to undergo the operation at my request. The benefits became immediately apparent to both of us and here we are promoting it.
She promotes it among women in her own small way by organizing women’s study circles and having group discussions where she freely airs her views while I for my part promote literature on the subject on the Internet and elsewhere, besides discussing it with friends and associates, many of whom I have been able to convince .
As with us, there are probably several others who can be made to understand the true position. And this is where the challenge lies. To change their minds. This can only be done by creating awareness on the subject. Explain to people including friends and particularly our youth and religious and community leaders and most importantly the media what female circumcision in Islam is really all about. Stress on its benefits while at the same time distancing it from the other forms of mutilation that take place in certain parts of the Muslim world such as clitoridectomy involving the removal of the clitoris that takes place in countries like Egypt and infibulation involving the cutting up and sewing of the female genitals that take place in countries like Somalia which really have nothing to do with Islam
One of the few countries where the proper Islamic procedure takes place is Malaysia and you will find no opposition to it. Women support it and even the government promotes it. On the other hand in countries where government authorities are taking action to ban or restrict it you will find that it is not only due to unwarranted pressure from the West, but also a perception that it is a harmful practice. I hear that even in Indonesia there are cases where the clitoris is removed. In other cases, it is a laceration of the clitoris involving the drawing of blood which again is unislamic and offers no benefit whatsoever. In such cases you will have to petition and convince the government to take measures to ban the harmful unislamic forms while legalizing the Islamic form.
As for your concern about the so-called Indonesian ban, I’m sure that If you are following the proper Islamic form, there is no need to obey such a ban as per the ahadith in Sahih Musim etc that states that Obedience to a ruler is only in what is right (Islamic) and not in what is wrong, in which case one is neither to listen to or obey him. Another hadith has it that the Created cannot be obeyed over the Creator which is very much the same thing. Thus the Muslim community is obliged to continue the practice whatever anybody might say.
It is heartening to note that there are some positive developments on this matter taking place worldwide. The International Muslim Women’s Union has taken a commendable stand on the issue, condemning the harmful forms and promoting the Islamic form. It regularly publishes articles like: Female Circumcision – Islam and Medical Perspective by Dr. Sitt Al Banat Khalid and Female Circumcision by Dr.Amal Elbasheir. The website of Atiyah Ansariyyah – www. Umatia.Org also actively promotes the procedure. See for example the article Stabilising female circumcision by Fathiya Hasan.
Last but no least there is an urgent need to promote Islamic female circumcision in a safe and clean environment including in hospitals and nursing homes where one is assured that the proper Islamic form in circumcising is strictly adhered to. There are many such hospitals in the West but sadly in the Muslim world it is left to some individual doctors and traditional practitioners to attend to it. This is unsatisfactory. It has to be promoted as a beneficial medical procedure offered in hospital or clinical settings to gain popularity. One manner of achieving this is to convince hospitals in Muslim countries to offer the procedure and make available such information to the public and media. I learn from you that Pusrawi is offering such a service and intend to promote it amongst my friends. But it is best that more hospitals offer this service at a reasonable cost just like Pusrawi.
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I think there was a ban in Indonesia ,and a ban to have it done in hospitals,but people ignored it and under pressure of the Islamic council the ban was removed,I think the ban is removed now? anyone? Yes ,Ahmed there is a need to train people in the proper form,in all Islamic countries.Some Indonesians think that by sticking a big needle in the hood,or pricking the hood or scrapping it the girl is circumcised and if asked these women will say they are circumsied.Yes,there is a need for proper training from the West and more clinics opening up including in Saudi Arabia.
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Dear Amelia
I understand your concerns, but no. This should not be done. No part of the clitoris should be touched. Islam has clearly laid down the procedure we should follow which is the removal only of the prepuce of the clitoris and nothing more. There is agreement on this. The Fath Al Bari by Ibn Hajar Asqalani, Sharhul Muhadhdhab by Imam Nawawi, Majmu Al Fatawa by Ibn Taymiyyah and Fatawa Al Islamiyya by Sheikh Jadul Haqq besides a number of other Islamic texts are all clear on this.
Besides, if there is going to be even a very minor removal of the tip of the clitoris, it can lead to more severe forms. In fact the severe forms we find being practiced today in some countries such as Sudan Egypt, etc which have given Islamic female circumcision such a bad name may have arisen from a similar reasoning. What starts in a small way can with time assume serious forms. This is why it is important that we as Muslims should always strictly adhere to the Sunnah.
As for your concerns about excess stimulation, I don’t think it arises except in exceptional cases where the clitoris is much larger than usual and therefore susceptible to extra stimulation when the glans clitoris is exposed. Such women should avoid wearing tight fitting clothes like jeans and riding bicycles or any other activity that could lead to unnecessary stimulation.
Hope this answers your concerns.
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Hi again !
I thought I must share this with you. A recent study Orgasmic Dysfunction Among Women at a Primary Care Setting in Malaysia. Hatta Sidi, and Marhani Midin, and Sharifah Ezat Wan Puteh, and Norni Abdullah, (2008) Asia Pacific Journal of Public Health, 20 (4) accessible http://myais.fsktm.um.edu.my/4480/ shows that being Non-Malay is a higher risk factor for Orgasmic Sexual Dysfunction in women, implying that Malay women experience less problems in achieving orgasm than non-Malay women. As you know almost all Malay women in Malaysia are circumcised (undergo hoodectomy) in contrast to non-Malay women who are not. This would suggest that hoodectomy does in fact contribute to an improved sex life in women rather than diminishing it as some argue.
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There is a study by an Indonesian university (available on the Net) on the many different styles of female circumcision practiced in their country. Some are symbolic involving no actual cutting while others involve removal of the clitoris (in part I think) and/or the labia minora. I have also been told of variations in FC practiced between East, West, Central Java and other parts of Indonesia. However I understand there is more “uniformity” in how it is done in Malaysia.
My wife is a mu’allaf and prior to her circumcision we had the opportunity to discuss the operation with the doctor at Pusrawi. The doctor suggested the standard method, i.e. removal of the clitoral hood only and no cutting of the clitoris itself or labia. My wife agreed to this method, and it was a quick operation, relatively painless (than she had expected) and healed in about 1 week.
For her, circumcision was beneficial in terms of health, hygiene and sex. Incidentally she sent both our daughters for circumcision without any reservations.
I agree this is a very good practice, if done correctly.
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Jazzakallah Thank you so much especialy brother ahmad. I really need to go to malaysia then to get it done proper. Please how can i better inform people in NAD and the kampung about the correct procedure because i am only a bule and they really don’t care for my opinion on anything religious.
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Dear Sister Julina
May Almighty Allah bless you. You went through it once and you want to go through it again because you feel it was’nt done properly Islamically the first time. This is how a true Muslimah would think. May Allah make things easy for you !
And you certainly don’t have to shy away from speaking about Islamic issues just because you are a convert. The earliest Muslims were all converts, and they were the best Muslims won’t you agree.
As to how you could convince Indonesians, it is a simple matter really. Just show them the proof in the hadith concerning Umm Atiyya and the statements in the Fath Al Bari by Ibn Hajar Asqalani, Sharhul Muhadhdhab by Imam Nawawi, Majmu Al Fatawa by Ibn Taymiyyah and Fatawa Al Islamiyya by Sheikh Jadul Haqq, all of which are agreed that the proper Islamic procedure is to remove the skin (prepuce) covering the clitoris and nothing more. You could also discuss the issue with your Muslim sisters and even have group discussions to create greater awareness on the issue.
Do your part in the small way you can and it will make a difference with Allah’s Grace
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That’s because the Malaysian are much better managed organized than Indonesians, in practically everything.
Back to female circumcision topic, actually there has been a discussion between the MUI ( Indonesia Islamic Council ) and IDI ( Indonesian Doctors Association )about the need to create a ‘standard female circumcision procedure’ that is both medically and Islamicly correct, a few years ago. However, until today, there has been no real action on it.
Thus, most female circumcision procedures in Indonesia are not carried out correctly. In most cases, only a nick to the clitoris or hood, just enough to draw blood and she’s considered ‘circumcised’
However, in the past few years, there has been quite a good movement in the internet on how female circumsision should be performed, which is removing the clitoral hood only to expose the glans, for better hyginie and better sexual pleasure, and these movements are conducted by individuals who really put so much care on this matter.
One of such discussion is written in the below link:
http://kaferemaja.wordpress.com/2009/07/01/cantiknya-muslimah-bila-dikhitan-subhanallah/
If you speak Indonesian ( Sister Julina,you should be speaking at least some Indonesian by now) this is a great example on how education on how female circumsision should be properly done.
There are some ‘rather dirty’ but funny jokes on female circumsision as well 😀
For sister Julina, if your circumcision had not been carried out properly, I think it’s best for you to have yourself properly circumcised (clitoral hood removed)
May Allah be praised.
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Cutting off any living part of a child without a valid medical reason is an assault. Particularly when this concerns the most sensitive parts of the body ie the genitalia. Skimming through the comments I see the same bullshit justifications for mutilation. It is not medically beneficial. No respectable medical organisation advocates it anywhere in the world. It does not improve sex. Destroying erogenous tissue decreases sensation. Leave girls AND boys alone!
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my sisters and brothers, there is no where in quran or ahadeeth mentioned that the women or girls be circumcised, and whoever says there is a hadeeth about prophet allowing it he or she is fabricating the hadeeth, and actually there is an authentic narration that when a sahabi had informed prophet about someone who was circumcising girls, the prophet had order for him to stop and if he wouldnt it was ordered for the man to be killed and prophet said Allah’s curse is a person who circumcises girls, and i am a scholar in islam, so who ever thinks she or he is doing the right thing, please stop it before you are thrown in jahannam.
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Hi Saima, don’t you worry. Most of the ahadith on female circumcision are authentic and support one another. There are some interesting articles giving the Islamic point of view in http://www.hoodectomyinformation.com if you only care to look. As for the so-called hadith you have given to prove that it is unislamic, it is a completely fabricated hadith. If you are the one who fabricated it, I ask you to repent, for whoever fabricates a hadith will take his or her seat in jahannam.
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For all female muallafs here, listen this, YOU ARE CONVERTING INTO A MOSLEM, NOT A MELAYU. As a moslem, you are clearly NOT required to do this but as a MALAY, maybe, yes. IF your boyfriend, or fiancee, or husband still doesn’t know that you don’t HAVE to undergo this to become even a ‘perfect moslimah’, he is an ‘uneducated moslem’ and I doubt he can teach you about his religious ever after.
“Hi Saima, don’t you worry. Most of the ahadith on female circumcision are authentic and support one another.”
-That’s untrue. ALL of them are weaklings and I can prove it. Here, no. I did it already in CARI forum. Look at parenting’s board there.
“As for the so-called hadith you have given to prove that it is unislamic, it is a completely fabricated hadith. If you are the one who fabricated it, I ask you to repent, for whoever fabricates a hadith will take his or her seat in jahannam.”
-And The Prophet had a converting wife, he NEVER told her to bersunat. Never cares at all! Oh how UNislamic he was! You Melayus are MORE Islamic than him today! Congratulations!
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So sorry for you Manzila. You just don’t know what you’re missing. A recent study Orgasmic Dysfunction Among Women at a Primary Care Setting in Malaysia. Hatta Sidi, and Marhani Midin, and Sharifah Ezat Wan Puteh, and Norni Abdullah, (2008) Asia Pacific Journal of Public Health, 20 (4) accessible http://myais.fsktm.um.edu.my/4480/ shows that being Non-Malay is a higher risk factor for Orgasmic Sexual Dysfunction in women, implying that Malay women experience less problems in achieving orgasm than non-Malay women. As you know almost all Malay women in Malaysia are circumcised by having the prepuce of the clitoris removed(hoodectomy) in contrast to non-Malay women who are not. This would suggest that Islamic female circumcision (hoodectomy) does in fact contribute to a better sexual life in women. Cheers !
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One more reason for a hoodectomy (Islamic female circumcision):
Oral sex linked to cancer risk
US scientists said Sunday there is strong evidence linking oral sex to cancer, and urged more study of how human papillomaviruses may be to blame for a rise in oral cancer among white men.
In the United States, oral cancer due to HPV infection is now more common than oral cancer from tobacco use, which remains the leading cause of such cancers in the rest of the world.
Researchers have found a 225-percent increase in oral cancer cases in the United States from 1974 to 2007, mainly among white men, said Maura Gillison of Ohio State University. “The rise in oral cancer in the US is predominantly among young white males and we do not know the answer as to why.”
It is obvious that the only way men can acquire the HPV virus is through the oral stimulation of one’s partner’s clitoris which allows the virus to enter the mouth. The virus no doubt is harboured in the prepuce of the clitoris just as it has been found that HPV also resides in the foreskins of males, through the transmission of which cervical cancer occurs in females.Thus a hoodectomy could, by removing the area which harbours the virus, significantly reduce or eliminate the risk of women transmitting the virus to their male partners.
Long live women with hoodectomies. Its good for them and their partners !
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This is one of the most fucked up things I have ever heard. Not least because nearly everyone in the comments seems to think it’s an acceptable procedure.
Why would anyone think it is better to modify the body than to leave it as it naturally is? If you think it’s “God’s will” or somesuch thing, then remember that supposedly God made the body to be that way. If He wanted it some other way, then it would be that way. All accounts of circumcision reducing STD and other infections are untrue- recent circumcisions make the body more susceptible, and healed circumcisions only make the sexual organs less sensitive.
This is an appalling horror.
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That’s because they are CRAZY. LOL Or just don’t wanna accept what they have lost. I am SURE someone is gonna comment saying “I didn’t lose anything”. YES YOU DID and you won’t know.
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FInallly! I see comments I agree with! I’m not circumcised, my mother did not want me to be circumcised and being half malay(my mum isn’t malay,dad is.) my mum got a lot of crap for the decision she made of not wanting me circumcised. I am happy for the decision she made. I too won’t have my daughter circumcised either. Why modify the body instead of leaving it the way it naturally is??
and for those saying women who are not circumcised have to deal with smell and all that, Let me tell you right now from an uncircumcised woman, I have not had to deal with smells, or anything else. How silly. It’s all based on how hygienic you are. AND if you did your research, doctors have said time and time again, there are no benefits to female circumcision. What a bunch of bollocks.
To those who think circumcising a female is alright, fine. But don’t do it to your daughters(or have your wife/fiance) have it done. It should be their own decision. If they don’t want it done then let it be. Let them enjoy sexual pleasure the way it was naturally meant to be enjoyed!
And also to those,don’t mix your cultural beliefs with religious beliefs. The Quran does not say females can be circumcised.
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They don’t enjoy sex like western women. It is very very sad.
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KK, What’s so appalling in about having a clean penis or clitoris ? All the available scientific evidence shows that circumcision for men and female circumcision (hoodectomy) for women confer numerous health benefits. So who are we to believe, the evidence or your mad rants ?
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There are good signs coming. As more and more Muslims come to learn about the benefits of hoodectomy (Islamic female circumcision) the practice is likely to gain in popularity.
Some countries that earlier banned it have allowed it again. This includes Indonesia which recently medicalised it and legally stipulated what needs to be removed, namely the prepuce of the clitoris. See http://jambi.tribunnews.com/2011/04/17/tak-paham-bisa-kebablasan
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I’m not saying that it has no benefit at all. For some women who don’t know a friggin’ thing about their genitals’ hygene and don’t even know what and where are their clitorises, maybe yes, for some who know a lot about hygene, and LOVE to have a sensitive clitoris, hell no. But that’s not my problem. I’m here to bring doom to ‘female circumcision hadeeth’ only.
A recent study Orgasmic Dysfunction Among Women at a Primary Care Setting in Malaysia. Hatta Sidi, and Marhani Midin, and Sharifah Ezat Wan Puteh, and Norni Abdullah, (2008) Asia Pacific Journal of Public Health, 20 (4) accessible http://myais.fsktm.um.edu.my/4480/ shows that being Non-Malay is a higher risk factor for Orgasmic Sexual Dysfunction in women, implying that Malay women experience less problems in achieving orgasm than non-Malay women. As you know almost all Malay women in Malaysia are circumcised by having the prepuce of the clitoris removed(hoodectomy) in contrast to non-Malay women who are not.
-An easy statement. How the hell did know that? Did they look at everyone pussies and say that? They SIMPLY say that because a ‘fact’ that most malay gals were circumcised. How about saying that just because of a pro partner, sexual knowledge, tongkat ali, kacip fatimah, ubat kuat, porns, etc etc exept bersunat? Same ol same ol, They USED to say “American gals become sluts because they didn’t circumcise, malay gals were innocent because they WERE circumcised.” Such a fool, they COMPLETELY forgot that MOST of baby dumping cases and illegal sexual actions were made by those malay gals who were circumcised. That also a ‘fact’. Now who is THE slut?! The malay gals who were circumcised or the non-malay who didn’t? Who cannot tame their sluttiness now?
It is obvious that the only way men can acquire the HPV virus is through the oral stimulation of one’s partner’s clitoris which allows the virus to enter the mouth. The virus no doubt is harboured in the prepuce of the clitoris just as it has been found that HPV also resides in the foreskins of males, through the transmission of which cervical cancer occurs in females.Thus a hoodectomy could, by removing the area which harbours the virus, significantly reduce or eliminate the risk of women transmitting the virus to their male partners.
-Hygene man, hygene! That’s clear. Cancer can come from everywhere, even from a mobile, so throw away your mobiles now? That’s the logic.
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You’re frustrated Manzila and from the kind of words you have used, you’re really frustrated, and I’m quite sure sexually frustrated !. Your rants against Malay girls is proof of that. Shame on you !
My sincere advice to you. Go to the nearest clinic and get a hoodectomy. It will make you a really nice and balanced person. If you’re oversexed and find it difficult to control your feelings, its probably because some hard particles of smegma beneath the prepuce of your clit is irritating it, arousing you constantly to a point you cannot control yourself.
On the other hand, If you cannot get any satisfaction from your sex life, that bit of skin covering your clit is again to be blamed as it is an obstacle to achieving real clitoral satisfaction. Further, it is a well known fact that men are turned off by bad smells during sex and when it comes to oral sex your partner will certainly find it disgusting if he has to orally stimulate your uncircumcised clit with that smelly bit of skin giving out bad odours and germs. So do yourself a favour and accept that beautiful cut. It will do you wonders !
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You are right Ahmed,may American woman are repulsed about giving oral sex to uncircumcised men,but American men are going down on uncircumcised clits,,..go figure??
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MALE OR FEMALE,circumcision should NEVER be inflicted upon another, period. If YOU think it’s so great, have it done to yourself. Many fringe people that are adults, mutilate their face, genitalia, ears, lips, etc.
But, adding female circumcision to the debate, does not make the American practice of routine infant circumcision, acceptable.
Hygene?!?!? Do you cut off his feet to prevent athlete’s foot later in life? Do you remove her breasts NOW, to prevent breast cancer later?
Cicumcisors, are VERY sick people, and their vicious damage is permanent, and can NEVER be undone…if you teach her it’s HER/HIS body, and how to clean it, they can decide to accept tortuous damage when they are full grown adults. (for Jews, this is 13, not 8 days, for muslims 14 years,) but, to ostracize them for choosing NOT TO…That’s the worst parenting of all.
If it is done for religious purposes, it should NEVER be performed in a hospital, but in the Synagog, Church, and Mosque, then only upon willing adults, and never coerced.
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I agree entirely with Paul Wall. No human being should ever have their body insulted by cutting, piercing, tagging or otherwise violating the personal integrity of their bodies, WITHOUT THEIR CONSENT.
Circumcision of infants is as cruel, pointless and primitive.
Ignorance and savagery perpetrated against one’s own offspring by using ‘culture’ or ‘cleanliness’ as an excuse is still ignorant, savage, and unforgivable. Millions of uncircumcised humans are not wrong. People who circumcise helpless infants are monstrous.
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This is not a rite of passage. The baby has just been initiated into the big, bright world. That’s initiation enough! A 44-day-old child is not able to participate in a rite of passage. They have no language and no concept of what is going on. Therefore, this is just another primitive ritual that is rationalized away as somehow beneficial to the child, when if fact only the adults benefit from it.
According to the description, the clitoral hood is removed. This is the most sensitive portion of the female genitalia and is called the prepuce. The same tissue in a man is called the foreskin. Both attackes are correctly called circumcision. Attack!? Sure. The child is defenseless and part of their body is cut off because some village elders centuries ago said so.
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Thanks for demonstrating that what our baby boys endure in America (and anywhere else that male genital mutilation is practiced – and yes, it is mutilation) have it much worse than what you have described here.
Having said that, this practice is still a violation of the child’s human rights, as is ANY form of non-therapeutic, *forced* genital cutting. And it’s quite disturbing that seemingly intelligent people even attempt to justify – or even advocate FOR – something so heinous.
If an adult wants to inflict something like this on themselves, have at it – but forcing it on the body of a non-consenting human being is simply inexcusable.
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oh dear, when will we learn? When will when actually learn about the body and it’s functions and how important each piece is? When will we learn and stop cutting off parts that are perfectly healthy? When we will learn to care for the child? When will we learn that this is harmful? when will we learn that this is not our body to modify? When will the ones who had it done to them learn that they have no right to do it to others? I would love to live in a world in my lifetime where circumcision amongst boys and girls (minors under the age of 18) doesn’t exist, and the choice to modify their bodies is left up to them.
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This article is absolutely disgusting written by a mother who OBVIOUSLY doesnt have a maternal bone in her body. This is a HORRIBLE mutilation done to a helpless baby. WHat is WRONG with you?????? You should be sterilized, and so should the rest of your “tribe” I hope you die a painful horrible death that you cannot defend yourself from like this baby was forced to go through while you stood by and WATCHED. A midwife is a midwife. She is not a plastic surgeon or ANY kind of surgeon. Who on earth would believe a mid-wife should perform sergery on their baby. You are bliund idiots….every last one of you.
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Hi Stacey
Why not take your fight to the US where as Amy observes helpless little baby boys are subjected to extremely painful circumcision as a routine procedure. You westerners are such damn hypocrites. Cutting little baby boys is alright, but performing an analogous procedure on a female infant and cutting much less skin, is unthinkable and penalised. Come on, be balanced in your views !
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BOTH are wrong.
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Agree!
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I find it ironic that Youtube removed this video yet allows graphic videos of male infant circumcisions to remain – circumcisions that are probably more brutal and more damaging than what was done here.
Nevertheless, it should be noted that there is no valid medical reason for circumcising children. The prepuce in both genders fulfills an important function, and removing it does not make one cleaner or healthier. Most of the world do not circumcise either their boys or their girls: http://www.circumstitions.com/Maps.html The USA is the only country where infant males are circumcised routinely while the circumcision of infant females remains illegal. They struggle to accept that hypocrisy – I suppose at least you approach the subject fairly.
Still, no child should be held down and cut against his or her will. I have no problem with genital cutting as a tradition or ritual if it is what is desired, but it should be consensual once one is old enough to make that decision. There is no evidence that circumcision is more painful for adults, and plenty to the contrary.
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YouTube is ownwed and operated by Americans and those same people are doing these procedures on their baby boys .I think it is totally hypocritical and sexist,xenophobic,and biased.Oh it is okay to show male circumcisions,but not okay female circumcision because one is accepted in our culture and the other is not.I think the videos are informative because it sheds light on Female Circumcision ,that not all female circumcision involves Pharaonic circumcision and another thing not all male circumcisions are done in hygenic ways in many culturesparts of Africa,Australian Aborigines,parts of Polynesia and some Tulis in the Phillipines are being done in unsterile environments with the same old blades and even rocks yes rocks by the same old person as female circumciison is done in Africa.
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“YouTube is ownwed and operated by Americans and those same people are doing these procedures on their baby boys .I think it is totally hypocritical and sexist,xenophobic,and biased.Oh it is okay to show male circumcisions,but not okay female circumcision because one is accepted in our culture and the other is not.”
That. I am not American – we do not circumcise either gender here and haven’t for decades. I think many people here would consider them similarly, at least those with an understanding of the most common types of female circumcision would. I’m not a fan of censorship at the best of times – I don’t see how a lack of education helps the world.
I do think that permanent decisions regarding the body should be made by the owner of the body. I talk with my children but don’t choose their religion for them. Ultimately, I believe a religious ritual chosen by a thinking adult – be it circumcision, baptism, whatever – has much more meaning than one forced upon a child too young to give consent.
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It is biased because You Tube is owned by Americans,and male circumcision is a practice they allow.
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As a Group working in the African music industry “Female circumcision explained | Turquoise and Roses” is right up our street and we will keep checking for interesting additions to your post. If you want to know more about Somalian Music Videos visit us at %URL% … Well written, thank you 🙂
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Seems the Malay missionaries need show all how to do a proper female circumcision .They might start with neighboring Indonesia where they are doing all sort of little or no cutting :rubbing,pricking,etc to now doing in hospitals and clinics but cutting to much including parts of the glans for what I read and continuing with muslims in the Phillipines,Thailand,Western China and in Africa and the Middle East where they are cutting too much :exisions and infibulations.There should be a Muslim World Council to show the proper way to female circumcision.Just a question I know China has a large muslim population especially in the West does anyone know if they practice female circumcision? what about Thai muslims? Phillipine muslims? Heard from a girl on Mindanao that she was circumcised.
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Seems that not only in Brunei and Malaysia,but in neighboring Indonesia ,female circumcision of girls at birth is being offered as a birth package:http://www.cirp.org/news/smh01-13-04/
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Maurina seems like in neighboring Indonesia ,the girls have no discomfort either and its done in sterile conditions:http://artsyspot.com/female-circumcision-in-indonesia/ ,so I guess not all female circumcision involves removing the whole clitoris or sewing(infibulation) if done correctly in the way the Koran says its fine,it seems most Muslims in the world are following sunna and its only in the Horn of Africa where the most barbaric forms are practiced.The sunna is to make woman have better sex and cleaning ,not to mutilate them and deprive them of sex .
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Are most muslim women circumcised? these are photos of Muslim girls getting circumcised in Iraq: http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view?back=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%3Fei%3DUTF-8%26p%3DFemale%2Bcircumcision%2Bin%2BIraq%26type%3D61107&w=160&h=106&imgurl=www.bing.com%2Fimages%2Fsearch%3Fq%3DFemale%2Bcircumcision%2Bin%2BIraq%23focal%3D3b47e742d9749556665e8de83f34794f%26furl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fwww.whnpa.org%252fcontest%252feyes2009%252fstills%252fpicturestoryfeature%252f01%252fimages%252f06_ajbtt_circumcision.jpg&size=&name=search&rcurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bing.com%2Fimages%2Fsearch%3Fq%3DFemale%2Bcircumcision%2Bin%2BIraq%23focal%3D3b47e742d9749556665e8de83f34794f%26furl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fwww.whnpa.org%252fcontest%252feyes2009%252fstills%252fpicturestoryfeature%252f01%252fimages%252f06_ajbtt_circumcision.jpg&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bing.com%2Fimages%2Fsearch%3Fq%3DFemale%2Bcircumcision%2Bin%2BIraq%23focal%3D3b47e742d9749556665e8de83f34794f%26furl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fwww.whnpa.org%252fcontest%252feyes2009%252fstills%252fpicturestoryfeature%252f01%252fimages%252f06_ajbtt_circumcision.jpg&p=Female+circumcision+in+Iraq&type=&no=3&tt=115&oid=http%3A%2F%2Fts1.mm.bing.net%2Fimages%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D1544594657592%26id%3Da4d357eea47df42a2bbc4236964e8c6e&tit=FEMALE+CIRCUMCISION+IN+IRAQI+KURDISTAN&sigr=174bjrhan&sigi=16tmr60jl&sigb=12g5n3j59&fr=freecause
Is it better to do it at birth? like American boys get circumcised at birth and the Jewish brit milah at eight days or is it better like most muslim do it at the same age boys get circumcised?
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Since female circumciison is not only done to girls in Brunei,but also in Malaysia and Sarawak,Indonesia,Mindanao(Phillipines) is this a regional practice among muslims? meaning the whole S.E. Asia muslim region practices it? and where else Pakistan,Iraq,Turkey,Syria,Iran Yemen,Saudi Arabia,Egypt are all muslim girls circumcised?
Also seems most muslims only remove part or all or the clitoral hood? This is the only true circumcision as far as compared to male circumcision ,in both only the prepuce is removed.
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Female circumciison in indonesia:http://www.asiacalling.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1559:the-rise-of-female-circumcision-in-indonesia&catid=1:indonesia&Itemid=263&lang=en
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http://kerrycollison.blogspot.com/2011/06/indonesias-female-circumcision-decree.html
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I’m a circumcised male and I much prefer circumcised females because I think they’re cleaner and they look better! I think male and female circumcision should be mandatory within the first three months of life.
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Its very unfortunate that some organisations like Darul Arqam in Singapore are being influenced by the Jews. They are saying that its only necessary for males and hiding the importance of circumcision for females. Its time we question them about it!
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female circumcision in Malaysia:http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/features/article/fgm-its-happens-in-malaysia-too/
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Male and female circumcison is not prcaticed by Hindus,Buddists and most Christians:
About half of: Malaysians (Hindu and Christian Tamils, Chinese and Orang Asli)
A significant minority of:
Bangladeshis (20% are Hindu)
Indonesia:Bali(Hindu) ,Iran Jaya,Timor and the southern Islands(Maluccas,Celebes,etc) ,most of Borneo unless they are Muslim.It is only practced on Java and parts of Sumatra where the moslems live,but Christan ,Buddists and other animist tribes do not practice male or female circumcision.
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girl getting circumcised in Malaysia:
http://thieneleventhhour.blogspot.com/2011/01/female-circumcision.html
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http://aandes.blogspot.com/2010/04/circumcision.html
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I really hate to break the news to you ladies, but I read through all the comments posted and the level of ignorance is beyond astonishing. If you are getting a Sunna one, you are removing the clitoral hood basically unless they remove the clitoris as well. The clitoral hood is not dirty, doesn’t cause infections or a smell. It protects the clitoris and has a role in stimulating it during sexual intercourse. One it is taken off, the clitoris harders and has nothing to protect it. In the west, when they get a procedure, it is not the same thing as circumcision. It’s usually done for women who have excessive skin hanging, so please don’t go around trying to use this to support how beneficial it is to cut the female genitals the way you do. Also, I can’t believe anyone could associate circumcision with God. God created the human body and if He didn’t want that piece of skin there, He wouldn’t have put it there.
My suggestion is you do more research and educate yourselves!!
Sorry, you don’t know what you’re missing out!!
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Muslim,Christian,Jewish,etc…I do not know why people are obssed with alternating or mutilating what the creator already created perfect? Wheather male or female we are already created in God’s image so why alter what is already created perfect? I particullary find it baffling to do it on newborns without their consent.
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When the Sun expands and bakes the Earth to a cinder, the stupidity and cruelty that is religion will die out. That is, unless some other event occurs where the humans die out leaving the world to atheistic animals.
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http://www.irinnews.org/Report/90366/INDONESIA-Female-genital-mutilation-persists-despite-ban
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the Shafiite school of Sunni muslim which is the predominate schoold in Brunei,Indonesia and Malaysia, states that female ‘circumcision’ is *obligatory*, that is, compulsory, just like male circumcision.
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http://www.indonesiamatters.com/648/female-circumcision/
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An excellent work on hoodectomy (Islamic female circumcision) is available at http://www.umatia.org/2011/Safe%20Female%20circumcision.doc
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https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/vvzwbcb80wqNUCzmTahCi5jyrqa9-Dfsj2n45gHKw1Q
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http://dheryudi.wordpress.com/2008/08/05/sunat-perlu-atau-tidak-sih/
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http://www.bt.com.bn/news-national/2012/08/29/circumcision-muslim-females-religious-rite-mora
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Child abuser! Good people do not use knives between their daughters’ legs.
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Hi,
I’m Ceyda. I’m a Turkish Muslim girl and I live in Istanbul. I’m looking for information about female circumcision. Unfortunately we, as girls, are not circumcised like boys when we we are kids here in Turkey. Is it possible for an adult lady to be circumcised? Do adult ladies get circumcised in your country?
Thank you very much for your help.
Ceyda
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Hi Ceyda
Here’s a link I just came across that covers the subject in depth. This guy has really done his research, showing why it is necessary, what needs to be done and its numerous benefits:
http://www.sailanmuslim.com/news/female-circumcision-the-hidden-truth-by-asiff-hussein/
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Thank you very much for the link you’ve provided, Firoza.
I will read it carefully.
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Hi Ceyda
Here’s a link to an organisation called Salama that does proper female circumcision (hoodectomy) for adult females. You can ask a Malay friend to translate or correspond for you:
http://www.salamaorganizer.com/2014/11/tidak-kurang-dari-100-muslimah.html
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Hi, I can not watch the video. please send the video to my e mail. ekzemant@gmail.com
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